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An Invite from the SEPF
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  An Invite from the SEPF
by: Dek, 14-08-2010 11:12 PM (#41)

Bash wrote:

How about a counter proposal? The SEPF fold. Take positions on a combined association for Scotland. That association then sends teams to both worlds..... and if the associations do not accept that, they get no Scottish representation.


Bash,

This is why we should have a meeting of the two bodies, because believe it or not
the above may be the start of the solution,
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: bagpuss, 15-08-2010 12:12 AM (#42)

Bash wrote:
bagpuss wrote:
Bash wrote:
HUTCHIE wrote:
Pool players aren't concerned regarding politics but unfortunately continually are effected by them,as in this case.Surely the choice policy is in breach of individuals freedom of choice?

If people prefer either ruleset for one reason or another surely it is their prerogative?I can only see positives for both organisations if choice policy is abolished,first and foremost for the players who should be the main concern in this issue?


With an opinion like that, you'll probably be from Fife!


Can you explain the relevance of your comment bash?

Does it matter where he is from. I am not into analysing every post you have made but you are clearly wrong in stating that lifting the choice policy would only benefit the top SPA players. Hutchies comments, of which to an extent i agree, contradict your opinion. Neither of us are anywhere near top players and it would certainly benefit us.
How about another counter proposal. Why dont the SPA fold and join the SEPF and unite the rule set? About as much chance as your counter proposal, i would guess?


I can explain it yes. This comes up almost every year these days, and 9/10 times it's raised by something from Fife. Simples.

Ok, so you've said that it would specifically benefit yourself and Hutchie. Please list 3 things that it would do for you personally which could be regarded as positive.

As for your tongue in cheek proposal - why would the dominant player fold? That's just silly. Please only post if you have something worth reading to say.


As you are an apparent expert with statistics i guess you have proof to back up your first point regarding 9/10? I would doubt it very much. As for 'something' that could be conceived as derogatory towards fifers.

Although i was simply pointing out that you were wrong in your statement regarding the benefits (incorrect etc) on a personal level it would benefit me in the sense that i could play pool with mates without fear of being banned from playing pool with other mates. Simples! On a wider scale my opinion is that lifting the ban will bring a great deal more quality players to the spa events. I dont believe there will be the same effect in the opposite direction but this of course is my opinion which i am entitled to and free to air in an open forum.

Which brings me quite conveniently to your third point. I will post whenever and wherever i wish, how i wish and in whatever tone i feel to portray. I am quite sure the same will be said for everybody that bothers their arse to post on this website. The reason for that is simple. This is an open forum open for opinions to be aired. Those opinions may differ from yours and others but that does not detract from the right to air it nor does it make them wrong. Your opinion is yours and is what it is but that does not mean it is correct. You seem to fail to grasp that point. You are not the law and i would be ever so grateful if you refrained from asking me not to post just because you disagree with the content. That could be taken as being anti fifeist which you clearly are not. I would hate you to come across as something you are not....... peace and love
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: cj1471, 15-08-2010 02:20 AM (#43)

gandalph wrote:
have to agree with Bash here what do the SPA have to benefit from this?


I find it really sad that people like Bash and Gandolph even ask these sort of questions

Pool is a pub game it will never be a mainstream sport and certainly will never be an Olympic sport so who cares who gains?

What will the SPA lose?

Do away with the choice policy and let AMATUER cueists decide what comps they want to play
 
Edited by cj1471 15-08-2010 02:29 AM
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: mini hartson, 15-08-2010 02:59 AM (#44)

cj1471 wrote:
gandalph wrote:
have to agree with Bash here what do the SPA have to benefit from this?


I find it really sad that people like Bash and Gandolph even ask these sort of questions

Pool is a pub game it will never be a mainstream sport and certainly will never be an Olympic sport so who cares who gains?

What will the SPA lose?

Do away with the choice policy and let AMATUER cueists decide what comps they want to play




yeah darts is a board game nevermind a pub ggame so wont be allowed in olympics but look how far thats got.....why cant we have dreams and ambitions to be like darts.....???????????????
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: Silky198, 15-08-2010 12:38 PM (#45)

secretary wrote:
Macleod00 wrote:

I didn't, at any point, mention Fife. Wink


I did.....

Every year....... Most months in fact....

and now have ....

Cowdenbeath..... Lochgelly.... Kirkcaldy (past sepf chairman's league) .... all playing blackball......

only one league now in Fife playing WR.... East Neuk.... and that's because George visited and promised an extra place (singles) at Blackpool. Cost them 340, and found it hard to fill it I believe.


Again Davy wrong as per usual, no problems filling the qualifier that East Neuk ran, think it cost an average of just under 10 a head, and the figure was 320. Aye all those league play Blackball but you have exactly zero affiliations from them and again zero players playing in IM's and the like so the point of me playing Blackball in those leagues (I've played them all like DDPL) and me being past SEPF Chairman has zero relevance, a lot of zeros for you today, well done.

As Derek has pointed out they just want to sit and talk, until that happens you can talk about good and bad points until the end of time, until something actually happens and the powers that be sit down and thrash out some compromise then we will never know, I really hope there is some kind of compromise made and would hope at least a meeting of the minds does happen and so that we can see where we stand. At every AGM I believe that the 'choice policy' comes up but it gets knocked back but hopefully it succeeds this next AGM, as mini hartson says you can only dream, I've played at Craig Tara in the past, great event, the SPA do run fantastic events, no one disputes that, anyway hope it happens and see how it goes.
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: secretary, 15-08-2010 03:32 PM (#46)

Silky198 wrote:
At every AGM I believe that the 'choice policy' comes up


No it doesn't.
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: alligator, 15-08-2010 06:24 PM (#47)

it will at the agm in january,i will also be asking at the next spa meeting that we the spa have representation in a meeting wiith the sepf.what harm can it do to sit and talk to these guys.in my humble opinion both the spa and the sepf would benefit from the spa getting rid of the choice policy.the spa numbers would increase for ims superleague etc and the sepf tournament entries would increase.everyone is a winner.so whats the problem because i cant see one.
 
wait and strike when the time is right
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: mini hartson, 15-08-2010 06:39 PM (#48)

alligator wrote:
it will at the agm in january,i will also be asking at the next spa meeting that we the spa have representation in a meeting wiith the sepf.what harm can it do to sit and talk to these guys.in my humble opinion both the spa and the sepf would benefit from the spa getting rid of the choice policy.the spa numbers would increase for ims superleague etc and the sepf tournament entries would increase.everyone is a winner.so whats the problem because i cant see one.



who are the big guns between the SPA and the SEPF......and am sorry but what is the difference is one like BDO and 1 like PDC of darts......from what i have read i cant see a problem with talking but its how far either is willing to take before thier is significant changes.....

i am sorry if am confused or have got the wrong end of the stick

cheers

mini
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: Dek, 15-08-2010 07:35 PM (#49)

mini hartson wrote:
[quote]alligator wrote:
it will at the agm in january,i will also be asking at the next spa meeting that we the spa have representation in a meeting wiith the sepf.what harm can it do to sit and talk to these guys.in my humble opinion both the spa and the sepf would benefit from the spa getting rid of the choice policy.the spa numbers would increase for ims superleague etc and the sepf tournament entries would increase.everyone is a winner.so whats the problem because i cant see one.


Glad to see some encouraging posts on here regarding the getting together of the SPA & SEPF, Mini the main difference between the two are that they are both affilliated to different world bodies and of course both play different rules BB & WR.
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago. I myself will be playing in Ross's 5 man team event in Stirling in a few weeks time.
Your players however do not get to play in any of our events because of the choice policy. And if you do play you threaten being banned from certain SPA events.
I believe as do the SEPF that this is wrong as we are playing in an amateur sport in our country and people should be free to choose when, where and what they play in without being threatened or punished.
If the talks happen and we get some mutual aggreement then there is also the oppotunity to have combined events which would benefit both sides.
That is what I see as the differences between the two and this is why I feel a meeting and discussion would only benefit everyone concerned.
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: Bash, 15-08-2010 08:01 PM (#50)

Dek wrote:
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago.


Clearly, this is a breach of current SPA rules and the guilty parties should be punished.
 
Serve no master, but your own ambition.
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: mini hartson, 15-08-2010 08:03 PM (#51)

Dek wrote:
mini hartson wrote:
[quote]alligator wrote:
it will at the agm in january,i will also be asking at the next spa meeting that we the spa have representation in a meeting wiith the sepf.what harm can it do to sit and talk to these guys.in my humble opinion both the spa and the sepf would benefit from the spa getting rid of the choice policy.the spa numbers would increase for ims superleague etc and the sepf tournament entries would increase.everyone is a winner.so whats the problem because i cant see one.


Glad to see some encouraging posts on here regarding the getting together of the SPA & SEPF, Mini the main difference between the two are that they are both affilliated to different world bodies and of course both play different rules BB & WR.
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago. I myself will be playing in Ross's 5 man team event in Stirling in a few weeks time.
Your players however do not get to play in any of our events because of the choice policy. And if you do play you threaten being banned from certain SPA events.
I believe as do the SEPF that this is wrong as we are playing in an amateur sport in our country and people should be free to choose when, where and what they play in without being threatened or punished.
If the talks happen and we get some mutual aggreement then there is also the oppotunity to have combined events which would benefit both sides.
That is what I see as the differences between the two and this is why I feel a meeting and discussion would only benefit everyone concerned.


thank you .......i only have 1 question i assume you guys have different rules i play in the LD's team and i know through experience that rule change for us can be difficult for some......will this be a problem.....i know it wont be for the others but it might us?
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: gandalph, 15-08-2010 08:37 PM (#52)

Dek wrote:
mini hartson wrote:
[quote]alligator wrote:
it will at the agm in january,i will also be asking at the next spa meeting that we the spa have representation in a meeting wiith the sepf.what harm can it do to sit and talk to these guys.in my humble opinion both the spa and the sepf would benefit from the spa getting rid of the choice policy.the spa numbers would increase for ims superleague etc and the sepf tournament entries would increase.everyone is a winner.so whats the problem because i cant see one.


Glad to see some encouraging posts on here regarding the getting together of the SPA & SEPF, Mini the main difference between the two are that they are both affilliated to different world bodies and of course both play different rules BB & WR.
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago. I myself will be playing in Ross's 5 man team event in Stirling in a few weeks time.
Your players however do not get to play in any of our events because of the choice policy. And if you do play you threaten being banned from certain SPA events.
I believe as do the SEPF that this is wrong as we are playing in an amateur sport in our country and people should be free to choose when, where and what they play in without being threatened or punished.
If the talks happen and we get some mutual aggreement then there is also the oppotunity to have combined events which would benefit both sides.
That is what I see as the differences between the two and this is why I feel a meeting and discussion would only benefit everyone concerned.


combined events?

there is not even enough weekends to support all the current SPA and Individual events
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: JB, 15-08-2010 10:58 PM (#53)

Bash wrote:
Dek wrote:
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago.


Clearly, this is a breach of current SPA rules and the guilty parties should be punished.


was thinking the same thing.....
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: Dek, 15-08-2010 10:58 PM (#54)

gandalph wrote:
Dek wrote:
mini hartson wrote:
[quote]alligator wrote:
it will at the agm in january,i will also be asking at the next spa meeting that we the spa have representation in a meeting wiith the sepf.what harm can it do to sit and talk to these guys.in my humble opinion both the spa and the sepf would benefit from the spa getting rid of the choice policy.the spa numbers would increase for ims superleague etc and the sepf tournament entries would increase.everyone is a winner.so whats the problem because i cant see one.


Glad to see some encouraging posts on here regarding the getting together of the SPA & SEPF, Mini the main difference between the two are that they are both affilliated to different world bodies and of course both play different rules BB & WR.
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago. I myself will be playing in Ross's 5 man team event in Stirling in a few weeks time.
Your players however do not get to play in any of our events because of the choice policy. And if you do play you threaten being banned from certain SPA events.
I believe as do the SEPF that this is wrong as we are playing in an amateur sport in our country and people should be free to choose when, where and what they play in without being threatened or punished.
If the talks happen and we get some mutual aggreement then there is also the oppotunity to have combined events which would benefit both sides.
That is what I see as the differences between the two and this is why I feel a meeting and discussion would only benefit everyone concerned.


combined events?

there is not even enough weekends to support all the current SPA and Individual events

At present we both run Interleague events with 250-300 players in attendance.
Imagine if this is run as a combined event which could involve maybe all leagues in Scotland 500-600 players. This could be played twice a year 2 weekends out of 52
One BB and One WR. This would unite the whole of the pool community in Scotland and would probably gain decent sponsorship from the venue and others which would raise income for both the SPA & sepf. Anyone in pool knows that there is no money in the game and whether it is the SPA going to France as you are this year or the SEPF going to Malta for the Euros in February Huge tournaments like mentioned above could help to finance all the players from both sides for international events.
As I think both sides will agree that the players selected to represent thier country often have to find individual sponsors or come up with the cash themselves.
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: gandalph, 15-08-2010 11:00 PM (#55)

Dek wrote:
gandalph wrote:
Dek wrote:
mini hartson wrote:
[quote]alligator wrote:
it will at the agm in january,i will also be asking at the next spa meeting that we the spa have representation in a meeting wiith the sepf.what harm can it do to sit and talk to these guys.in my humble opinion both the spa and the sepf would benefit from the spa getting rid of the choice policy.the spa numbers would increase for ims superleague etc and the sepf tournament entries would increase.everyone is a winner.so whats the problem because i cant see one.


Glad to see some encouraging posts on here regarding the getting together of the SPA & SEPF, Mini the main difference between the two are that they are both affilliated to different world bodies and of course both play different rules BB & WR.
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago. I myself will be playing in Ross's 5 man team event in Stirling in a few weeks time.
Your players however do not get to play in any of our events because of the choice policy. And if you do play you threaten being banned from certain SPA events.
I believe as do the SEPF that this is wrong as we are playing in an amateur sport in our country and people should be free to choose when, where and what they play in without being threatened or punished.
If the talks happen and we get some mutual aggreement then there is also the oppotunity to have combined events which would benefit both sides.
That is what I see as the differences between the two and this is why I feel a meeting and discussion would only benefit everyone concerned.


combined events?

there is not even enough weekends to support all the current SPA and Individual events

At present we both run Interleague events with 250-300 players in attendance.
Imagine if this is run as a combined event which could involve maybe all leagues in Scotland 500-600 players. This could be played twice a year 2 weekends out of 52
One BB and One WR. This would unite the whole of the pool community in Scotland and would probably gain decent sponsorship from the venue and others which would raise income for both the SPA & sepf. Anyone in pool knows that there is no money in the game and whether it is the SPA going to France as you are this year or the SEPF going to Malta for the Euros in February Huge tournaments like mentioned above could help to finance all the players from both sides for international events.
As I think both sides will agree that the players selected to represent thier country often have to find individual sponsors or come up with the cash themselves.


AND ONCE AGAIN the little guy pays for the top players
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: cj1471, 16-08-2010 02:27 AM (#56)

Bash wrote:
Dek wrote:
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago.


Clearly, this is a breach of current SPA rules and the guilty parties should be punished.


Bash have you heard yourself.guilty parties.breach of rules.punished

GET A FECKIN LIFE ITS A PUB GAME
 
Edited by cj1471 16-08-2010 02:29 AM
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: knowledge, 16-08-2010 07:38 AM (#57)

By all means have a meeting, but have the meeting with a view to having one ruleset in Scotland, i.e. Have the meeting with the good and the future of the game in mind.

Don't have a meeting just to dream up some code whereby top players can play more events, once these guys get that and are happy the drive to unite will mysteriously disappear.

Yes if I sponsored one of the best players in the world I'd want him in the sky event, yes if I was a WR player I'd want in the IM and in various of the other SPA backed events but other than giving certain guys access to a potential few quid they do not have access to just now, how does that help the game?

Not the SPA, not the WR body not the top players, the game?

I could be wrong but the SPA are not going to leave BB here, no chance, so other than a pleasant chat and possibly a penguin, unless the WR guys are going to derigester, which I do not think they are, what would be the purpose of a meeting?
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: knowledge, 16-08-2010 08:08 AM (#58)

maxi wrote:.

I'm extremely confident you will find far more SEPF players playing in BB events than the other way around.

.

I agree entirely with that Maxi, now could you, as champion of the little guy, the guy who got the cat B players removed from IM5 please explain the benefit of this to those players?

Can you in fact explain the benefit of removal of the choice policy to any but a top SPA player? I have long advocated the removal of the choice policy, I have always thought it to be a division our game does not require but the root of the problem for pool has always been multiple rulesets.

Darts has shown that multiple governing bodies can succeed as long as the pie is big enough to slice, alas, and I'm sure Jonesy would agree, there is insufficient pie in pool.

However multiple governing bodies and multiple rulesets are not the same thing.

I'd like to see the choice policy go but only as part of a genuine plan to unite the game.
 
Edited by knowledge 16-08-2010 08:13 AM
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: Woody, 16-08-2010 08:11 AM (#59)

Bash wrote:
Dek wrote:
The SEPF already have players playing in various BB events.We have players on the CP Tour,The IM's and some of our players were recently invited to Maxi's Invitational Event a few weeks ago.


Clearly, this is a breach of current SPA rules and the guilty parties should be punished.


It would be, but the guys wrong the SEPF wont have any players playing IMs.
 
Am more confussed than a baby racoon!!!!!
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RE: An Invite from the SEPF
by: furrybeast, 16-08-2010 08:26 AM (#60)

knowledge wrote:
maxi wrote:.

I'm extremely confident you will find far more SEPF players playing in BB events than the other way around.

.

I agree entirely with that Maxi, now could you, as champion of the little guy, the guy who got the cat B players removed from IM5 please explain the benefit of this to those players?

Can you in fact explain the benefit of removal of the choice policy to any but a top SPA player? I have long advocated the removal of the choice policy, I have always thought it to be a division our game does not require but the root of the problem for pool has always been multiple rulesets.

Darts has shown that multiple governing bodies can succeed as long as the pie is big enough to slice, alas, and I'm sure Jonesy would agree, there is insufficient pie in pool.

However multiple governing bodies and multiple rulesets are not the same thing.

I'd like to see the choice policy go but only as part of a genuine plan to unite the game.


The problem needs to be fixed at the top of the tree, until that happens the whole set-up at local and national level will always be a mess.

The WEPF need to talk the WPA again, and KEEP talking until it's sorted. Both sides have so much to gain, and the nett benefit will be to all (even the little people!)
 
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